Ye Religion Thread

[jägermonsta]

no. you are wrong.

wow reaper very thought out.

 

[reaper]

interesting, I didn't explain myself in an imaginary reply.

[quadz]

Has this been proven?

[Whirlingdervish]

Satan is the reason for Hurricanes. They are too huge and complex and destructive to be the result of delicate weather patterns.

that is all.

 

[reaper]

As I recall, you went with the same "there's not enough information" hedge.

If that's true (meaning, if I've remembered that exchange correctly) then there's little point in talking about what we've learned about how biological life works, if you don't even accept the scientific explanation for thunder being able to stand on its own without god's help.

i don't think we know who or what created life, so it doesn't mean much to me that there are or might be many earth like planets.

[Robot]

quadz, if you are the scientist here, can you answer how scientific misconduct happens?  For all you know, it occurs daily, right alongside the media twisting and fabricating stories everyday.  Just the other day, I've seen how the media twisted around my mom's words about a particular homicide story here.  They tried to make it look like our neighbours had moved because of "drug deals happening in the bushes" (which somehow leads to homicides???) outside our apartment instead of just their neighbours being loud.

Also, I'm not that impressed with people claiming the universe is here or the universe is the way it is because of "random" "chaotic" behavior occuring.  That to me is very unsettling.

[quadz]

quadz, if you are the scientist here, can you answer how scientific misconduct happens?

[quadz]

As I recall, you went with the same "there's not enough information" hedge.

If that's true (meaning, if I've remembered that exchange correctly) then there's little point in talking about what we've learned about how biological life works, if you don't even accept the scientific explanation for thunder being able to stand on its own without god's help.

i don't think we know who or what created life, so it doesn't mean much to me that there are or might be many earth like planets.

[Robot]

Based on my experience, I think the idea that God plays active roles in the functioning of the universe is a controversial hypothesis.  I believe the universe is a bunch of self-sustaining systems designed by a God.  I have a very hard time trying to envision that every living system from humans to trees to bacteria are all the result of "random modeling" I suppose you could say.  It seems to me randomness is nothing more than "I don't know how it works because I haven't yet worked that out".

[Whirlingdervish]

Well I found a great quote today:

[reaper]

No matter how much we've discovered about the biological and chemical engines of life, you seem to want to disregard the details and fall back on variations of your, "it would be incomprehensible" routine.

if you made a case for life being on other planets, i'd agree with you.

[quadz]

I have a very hard time trying to envision that every living system from humans to trees to bacteria are all the result of "random modeling" I suppose you could say.

The fossil record mapping the evolution of species is fairly extensive.

And it's a misconception that evolution is a random process.  The mutation is random, but the process of natural selection is not random at all.  It may not be a very efficient process; but it's definitely not random.

(Some reasoning about Evolution as an Intelligent Process, in the context of the quest for computer AI:
http://www.beachbrowser.com/Archives/Science-and-Health/June-99/the-age-of-intelligent-machines-part-2.htm )

Note, also, that we understand genetic mutation well enough now to actually write DNA programs--using real DNA, not simulated--that execute in cups of coffee and solve nondeterministic polynomial problems by massively parallel replication and mutation.  The DNA can be programmed so that only the mutations that solve the problem survive.

  --> this isn't the exact article I was looking for, but close enough:
        http://www.columbia.edu/cu/21stC/issue-1.3/dna-soup.html

Regards,

quadz

[Robot]

I'm sorry, but that did not make sense to me, natural selection is not a "random process", but the change in genetic code being controlled by a process seeking an intelligent change isn't? ...

[quadz]

if you made a case for life being on other planets, i'd agree with you.

Given what we've observed so far, I think the onus should be on someone to make a case against life being on other planets at this point, because the case for it seems rather overwhelming.

For example: The more we look on our own planet, the more we find forms of life that can thrive in incredible, extreme conditions.

[quadz]

I'm sorry, but that did not make sense to me, natural selection is not a "random process", but the change in genetic code being controlled by a process seeking an intelligent change isn't? ...

I'm not sure I understand the question.

What I was saying was, the genetic mutation is random, but the overarching process of natural selection (of which genetic mutation is just a part) is not random.


Regards,

quadz