Author Topic: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2  (Read 5206 times)

Offline quadz

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2016, 12:42:57 AM »
For copyright reasons, I have removed this pak from the web. It's obviously been years since I compiled this pak, but from what I remember, all of the sounds and most of the images contained it were ripped directly from the original Quake1 game, which would make it, let's say, less than 100% legal to post on the web for public consumption.

Quadz, for your own sake, I'd highly recommend removing any of the paks and files you attached to any of your posts in this thread if they are copyrighted.

Interesting. I'm not a lawyer, so this definitely isn't legal advice. But I guess I'd thought any sounds/textures from Q1 shareware (and/or Q1test) which are already freely downloadable from id Software's FTP site, are probably something id would be cool with being mixed into fan-made nonprofit paks for another one of their games (i.e. Q2.)

ftp://ftp.idsoftware.com/idstuff/quake/

I suppose if they were sounds or textures that didn't exist in the shareware version, that might be more of an issue? But it's not clear to me how borrowing (repackaging) freely downloadable Q1 content for use in Q2 would be causing any harm, economic or otherwise.

(Again, not a lawyer though.)


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Offline |iR|Focalor

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2016, 12:48:11 AM »
Hmm, yeah, you have a point there. Thing is... I'm almost positive that I did not take anything from a shareware version of the game. It's been so long ago that I can't really remember, but I think I downloaded a full version of the game which I didn't pay for either from someplace on the web or through a torrent, and that's where everything came from. But yeah, I guess they would be the same files from the shareware version. I was looking through a Q1 forum somewhere else and it seemed like an admin there removed a download link from someones post because the item had content originally from either the pak0 or pak1 file from Quake. I guess maybe I should dig a little deeper and find out if they know something we don't.
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Offline |iR|Focalor

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #17 on: July 28, 2016, 02:18:38 PM »
After asking about it on the QuakeOne forums, they all seemed to have a slightly different opinion on it from you. They make some pretty good points. Read for yourself here.

I don't think any individual is gonna be able to definitively answer the question about it. So I really only see two routes to go. #1, read the license that comes with the shareware version of Quake, or #2, email id and ask them if it's okay, and if it's not, then "May I please have the expressed written permission of the NFL to do it?", to which they'll probably say, "Nope."

Unfortunately... I don't have the shareware version, and I can't find one that is unpacked from the BAT file to where I can read the license TXT. I found this, but who the hell knows if that's 100% accurate. And I wouldn't even begin to know how to contact anyone at id about this. From what I saw on their site, I couldn't find a tech support email, just some form to fill in where they probably won't even read whatever you send them. Dunno that I'd WANNA talk to them either. I'm afraid if I pointed them to the page where the pak was, they might start digging around and find some shit that either I or someone else posted and... yeah, might be a bad idea.
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Offline |iR|Focalor

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2016, 03:17:25 AM »
Anyway, just this white boy's opinion that the file should stay down since it's questionable. Besides, Prophet was mainly the one who wanted the pak, and he already got it. I don't anticipate anyone else will likely give a shit to want it. I mean... Just look at it. It's crap. My pak'ing skills have come a long way since this piece of shit was posted. If I were to make a Q1 pak today, it would be WAAAAY better looking than this pathetic garbage.
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Offline quadz

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2016, 01:23:09 PM »
After asking about it on the QuakeOne forums, they all seemed to have a slightly different opinion on it from you. They make some pretty good points. Read for yourself here.

I'm in agreement with their points, but they're speaking to the general case.

They're entirely correct that the assets in the shareware Q1 paks retain id Software's copyright, and that the redistribution of these assets is bound by whatever license they were released under (which could be as simple as, "All Rights Reserved.")

So yes: When in doubt, it's safest to assume redistribution of said assets in any customized or repackaged form, is prohibited unless expressly permitted the license, or unless one has obtained special written permission from the copyright holder.

(It was probably a mistake for me to assume everyone already knew this much going into it, since it is merely by chance that my own profession has put me in the position of needing to think about software copyright issues for some decades now.)

Given all of the above as a starting point, my own (non-legal) opinions were intended to address a very specific scenario: Fan-made not-for-profit repackaging of shareware assets from id Software game "A" for use in id Software game "B".

This is the narrow use case under which I'd made the observation: I don't see how this causes any harm, financial or otherwise.

In other words, if my own company had developed a series of games called Quark, I find myself unable to see why I would be anything but pleased to learn that fans of the series still cared enough after all these years to want to remix some shareware assets from Quark 1 into Quark 2.

So I suppose I'm making an argument for the spirit of the law vs. the letter of the law.

But this is certainly just a personal opinion (from someone whose income depends on customers purchasing rather than pirating my own software.)


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Offline |iR|Focalor

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2016, 12:46:45 PM »
Well... what software do you make? I'll pirate it, just for the hell of it. ;D

I mean if you're saying it shouldn't be a problem, I do agree. How much would it cost to pay a lawyer to sue you or me over something as small as this? There's really no damage being done to them, and no one's been making any money from it. id Software's legal team would have to be pretty fucking bored, in a bad mood, and just looking to fuck with someone for the sake of sadistic amusement to make an issue out of this. I don't see where them suing could net anything but a financial loss for themselves. On the other hand... technically they could. And since you pay for the webspace, I don't wanna do anything to possibly fuck you, that wouldn't be cool.

Another thing... I think I've seen clients out there packaged in zips or rars or exe installers that contain the shareware files which make it possible to play Q2 multiplayer without a complete version of the game. If the shareware files are bundled along side the client in the same container, and they aren't in their original standalone form, that's kinda ALSO against the license in the shareware, right? That's as bad or worse than what I've done, and I don't see id Software going after those people.

It's fuckin' gray, man. If you want me to re-upload it, I will, only if you demand it though. I ain't skeered of lawsuits myself. Of all the things I've ever done with an internet connection concerning copyright, this ain't shit. :D
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Offline Jay Dolan

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Re: Focalor's Quake1 Pak for Quake2
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2016, 06:23:59 PM »
Another thing... I think I've seen clients out there packaged in zips or rars or exe installers that contain the shareware files which make it possible to play Q2 multiplayer without a complete version of the game. If the shareware files are bundled along side the client in the same container, and they aren't in their original standalone form, that's kinda ALSO against the license in the shareware, right? That's as bad or worse than what I've done, and I don't see id Software going after those people.

Yea, older versions of my Quake2 builds for Mac did just this. The internal layout of an OS X .app bundle is pretty foreign, maybe even intimidating to your average user. And so rather than force the ~200 people who download the thing to fumble through a command line for the first time in their lives, I decided to include the shareware .pak files for convenience. I know that this technically violates the Quake2 EULA, but sometimes, you just gotta do what's right ;)

I've since moved to an rsync distribution channel, with a client script that prompts users to accept the Quake2 shareware license before it downloads any data.

 

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-Unh0ly-

March 24, 2020, 05:42:49 PM
TEXTURE PAK UPDATE!!!!!

http://unh0ly.wordpress.com

Punk_FAS

March 23, 2020, 06:07:31 PM
That sucks... maybe (probably) that same person that loves to join the DM server with his script/bot (was going by equate last I saw).
 

Admin

March 23, 2020, 02:12:22 PM
Yes it's a DoS attack
 

Admin

March 23, 2020, 02:06:20 PM
Might be a Denial of Service attack of some sort. Something is making the DM server take 100% CPU. (Will investigate when I can, at work right now.) Restarting DM server didn't help.
 

Admin

March 23, 2020, 02:00:18 PM
How strange.

Punk_FAS

March 23, 2020, 01:59:50 PM
netgraph looks pretty normal from what I can tell too. I've taken a number of screenshots with it up - not sure if that's helpful or not.

Punk_FAS

March 23, 2020, 01:59:15 PM
It looks like we're having a LAN party wherever the server is located. Pings are like in the low single digits for almost everyone. Even the people who normally ping in the upper 100s are showing pings of like 25ish. This is on DM anyway.
 

|iR|Focalor

March 23, 2020, 01:57:11 PM
only DM, vanilla and railz running smooth

Punk_FAS

March 23, 2020, 01:49:52 PM
I changed it to 1 - let's hope that resolves the issue I was noticing.

Thanks for the replies.

Punk_FAS

March 23, 2020, 01:49:18 PM
m_directinput - I had that at 2, which is supposedly only necessary for very slow PCs. I was noticing that sometimes my mouse movements seem to be too fast for my mouse's sensor.

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