Spanking

[peewee_RotA]

Figured every debate under the sun has gone on over here, but so far I haven't seen anything on this.

My opinion:
Generally to the rational human being it's not an issue.  However some people think that it's appropriate to let a government tell you how to raise your children. If you disagree with spanking then don't spank your children, however getting the government to tell me how to raise MY children is the biggest of all possible violations of freedom.

Discuss...

[[BTF]Jehar]

By the off chance, have you read Starship Troopers by  Heinlein? The movie is NOTHING like the book, which is more like a fictional backdrop for the author to write essays on things such as capital punishment, citizen's rights in society, the role of the military, etc.

He's written some profound things on discipline, juvenile "delinquency", etc. While I don't agree with everything he says, he writes well and is a sound thinker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers

[reaper]

Ron Paul for president?

[[BTF]Jehar]

That's another topic, but I respect the man on the basis that he knows and understands the difference between his personal beliefs and what actually benefits the country. Ie, he's pro-life, but he's not going to use his position as a lever for that platform. He understands that civil liberties take precedence overall, and he does so in a consistent way.

Anywho, to elaborate other than linking cool books: I don't see spanking or discipline as a "understanding of authority figures". The way I see it, it's the development of understanding of consequences. Actions have effects, and they are not always desirable. What's more, those effects are not always under your control. As a child, the lack of control comes from your parents. As an adult, that lack of control comes from the world itself - you as an individual do not call the shots.

[Arm0r]

I think the reason our streets already harbor multiple fuckin punks/jerkoffs and all around losers is because kids don't get hit....I remember when I was younger, that was the rule; you fuck up=your ass is kicked--simple and sweet and I got the point, now when I say "your ass kicked" I don't mean grab a chair and bludgeon your kid with it, but there is nothing wrong with a quick swat across the back of the head if it's needed.

I have a friend named Katie, she has a 3 year old daughter named Kasey...Kasey is a great kid, funny, smarter than alot of 3 year olds are but she has zero concept of the word "No" or "you have to do this", she is one of those kids who you will catch with a full cup of water in her hands...you tell her to be careful and she'll stare at you and drop the cup just to see your reaction....now the other day Katie was arguing with her...now let that sink in, having an argument...with a 3 year old....she was telling her it's time to leave...Kasey said no and made Katie+her ride wait for 20 mins till finally I got pissed and said "she's fucking 3, make her do it, you're the parent"...she got mad, was I in the wrong?..I don't think so, I call it tough love.

[[BTF]Jehar]

In high school, I noted that a lot of depression\anxiety was attributed to people not being able to control things. The situation takes a turn they don't like, they're not in control and they don't understand why. I for one think that a rise in depression\suicide and a drop in child discipline are linked. As toddlers, we all become ego-centric. Young children believe they are the center of the universe, and spanking is one way of growing out of that mindframe.

I think if you look around, you can see many adults who still believe themselves to be all-controlling and all-important (they may not say so, but it's evidenced in their actions). I wonder how many of them got spanked.

[X'tyfe]

heh, we have no rules in my house. we can do what ever the fuck we want my sister takes advantage of this in the wrong way though
and its very hard on my mom, im sure she will have a heart attack soon because of it

back when my dad was around, no one would ever pull shit like she does cus they knew it was suicide and back when we were little kids, we would get "spanked" until it was outlawed

[Gortarzis]

I completely agree with all of you people. Children need to learn that actions have consequences. And when they are young, especially toddlers, the best, and most, how shall I say this, efficent?, way to teach them the consequences of their actions is through pain. Of course, I am not saying beat the crap out of them, never do that, that is wrong, but just spank them on the butt a few times. It is a basic instinct, if doing something causes you pain, whether through the direct process of, or as a result of, you stop doing it. Well, usually. Quite honestly, some people do not even learn from the pain. Although I hated being spanked when I was a child, I now see that it was the best way for my parents to teach me about actions and consequences.

And I also know the flip side of this. I know people who were spoiled as kids and rarely, if ever, got disciplined, and I even have a little toddler-aged cousin who is rather spoiled. And I know that if his mother and everyone else keeps treating him the way they do, he will become a spoiled, self-centered, and most likely rebellious teenager and adult. People of all ages need discipline, for children, the majority of it needs to be physical. After all, a time out does not really accomplish anything if the child learns nothing from it. Am I right? Perhaps?

Also, VOTE RON PAUL!

[[BTF]Jehar]

As another Ron Paul plug, I think he's one of the first candidates to run under the ideals of being an American. He's not running as a Democrat, Republican, white, black, monotheist, atheist, or anything else. He's running as an American citizen. Because of this, he's able to speak to people regardless of social, economic, or philisophiocal groups. Go Ron

[X'tyfe]

:O

[.]

sanction: reward for good behavior, discipline for bad. I do not know why, inflicting physical force, is necessary to get a message through to a child that they have acted in an inappropriate manner. I do not understand why yelling at a kid is necessary as well. But, I do not have any children, so of course I feel like an expert on the subject.

Around Christmas I saw this article, was tempted to post it on this forum to see responses. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,317014,00.html

I find the punishment this parent performed was adequate, not abusive or cruel. Others found it horrific.

[peewee_RotA]

Around Christmas I saw this article, was tempted to post it on this forum to see responses. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,317014,00.html

I read that article a while back. I thought it was ingenious, however I tend not to give the benefit of the doubt to children with those kind of expensive gifts. I was not by far poor, but that's spoiled by my standards. So I'm not going to assume the dad had been the perfect disceplinarian model before the fact.

[DrkKnight]

I have two kids and both of them got thier fair share of spankings but they also knew why they were spank so they never got in trouble again because they knew they would get spank. no one is going to tell me how to raise my kids. 

[Gortarzis]

Around Christmas I saw this article, was tempted to post it on this forum to see responses. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,317014,00.html

I find the punishment this parent performed was adequate, not abusive or cruel. Others found it horrific.

Indeed. That is an adequate punishment. And I do not see how it is anyone's business, or even their right, to judge him on it. He is not physically or mentally abusing his child, so quite frankly, the punishment works.

[MyDocuments]

Heh, my kids get spanked if they need it, just like I did. They have to push pretty far though, spankings are very rare - I think the last spanking occured over a year ago in my household. Usually when they misbehave they get sent to their room or I just irritate the crap out of them for an hour or so. Writing lines works pretty good when my boy misbehaves at school. I have another rule that any stuff they leave lying around gets picked up by me and put in my closet. I have lots of toys in my closet and use "pick what you want" as a reward sometimes. I can very much see myself pulling some type guitar hero ebay stunt some time in the future. That'll learn em!

 I don't need the Government telling me how to do anything thank you very much.

Ron Paul is a wonderful person, he's honest, very intelligent and has integrity, however I don't agree with a lot of his views. I actually feel sorry for him though because he deserves to do better than he is doing. I wish him luck!

Also, I believe he would do better if he used his donations to pay for tv ads etc. Most people have never heard of him. His followers spamming the Internet does not equal votes.