Author Topic: weapon power  (Read 4917 times)

l0ckp1ck

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weapon power
« on: October 05, 2010, 03:58:21 AM »
I was on dm just now, there were only 3 of us in there playing on q2dm8. I had red armor and full health, yet was taken out with a single rail shot. Is this possible?
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 04:01:35 AM by |iR|Alpha »
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Offline haunted

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2010, 04:08:25 AM »
not possible. I'm pretty sure that as long as you have some RA, It will absorb damage at a 4:1 ratio to your health. The obvious example is at full health + 100 RA, a slug takes away 100 units so 80 RA / 20 health gone leaving you with 80h and 20 RA.
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l0ckp1ck

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2010, 04:30:43 AM »
so how was i taken out then? i wasn't lagging, i didn't fall, didn't take any previous shots, but was taken out by 1 rail shot in the open in a 1 on 1 situation by a player jimmy jones, obviously an alias
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Re: weapon power
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2010, 04:40:06 AM »
quad maybe. wait thats warehouse right? maybe there were 2 shots that hit you.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 04:41:37 AM by yahoo »
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Offline [BTF] Reflex

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2010, 05:15:16 AM »
Demo would be helpful, there may have been more going on than you thought.

Don't think you can hack the damage done,  that I have heard is server side.
All a client can do is say "I was facing this way and fired this gun"

I wonder if you can send multiple fire commands?  Highly doubt it.
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Offline Slayer :D

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2010, 05:35:59 AM »
You can (and do) send a "+attack" command every time you press the fire button. When you release it, you send a "-attack" command. It is up to the game dll to decide what to do with it. (In other words, you can't hack damage given.)
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Offline Barton

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2010, 10:01:31 AM »
You probably got railed twice but didn't notice.
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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2010, 10:36:16 AM »
There is a bug, that I suppose many people aren't aware exists, where if you get railed AND the rail shot that hits you also gibs an existing corpse at the same time, the rail does > the usual 100 damage (though I'm not sure exactly how much).  I used to be on both the giving and receiving end of this on the Mage Warehouse server many times, years ago.  I'm pretty sure I recall experiencing it somewhat recently too.

But in your case, you probably got railed twice.  The bug I mentioned does just a little over 100 damage I believe, though I'm really not sure the exact amount.  Also, I'm not sure if the corpse that also gets gibbed needs to be within a certain proximity of you when you get railed or not.  You may have to be literally standing on the corpse when it happens.
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Offline Kyper

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2010, 10:45:17 AM »
Demo of 'rail through corpse' bug: http://q2scene.net/ds/index.php?op=dd2&id=1112818918

It does at least 150, maybe does twice as much (200)?
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Offline VaeVictis

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2010, 04:34:37 PM »
Demo of 'rail through corpse' bug: http://q2scene.net/ds/index.php?op=dd2&id=1112818918

It does at least 150, maybe does twice as much (200)?

could just do whatever is left over from gibbing the corpse... for example the corpse needs 20 damage to gib, it will transfer the other 80 damage to the other entity it hit with some flaw in the algorithm

just a thought

and yeah i can recall a time or two where i swear i had a full health and armor stack and died in a single rail, either you arent paying attention as much as you thought and eat some damage from elsewhere or it really is a glitch, i dont really know :P either way if its a glitch it must not happen often enough to be too big of a problem
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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2010, 06:53:57 PM »
You're probably more likely to encounter it in FFA since there are many more players running around with a rail, and lots more corpses too.
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Re: weapon power
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2010, 07:04:58 PM »
Theres also a bug regarding a dead corpse next to a glass pane or window. blasters and explosions can pass through them.
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Re: weapon power
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2010, 07:05:38 PM »
Probably a quad. If not, then you were just mistaken and got shot multiple times. This kind of misjudgment is very common. Most new players are convinced that better players spawn with armor. Nothing to be embarrassed about if you are simply mistaken.


To correct others, it -is- possible to fire multiple railshots at once. It's difficult and impossible to aim. There are tricks that you can do with time-refresh that cause your client commands to be queued up and executed at once. Same trick can be used to do super rocket jumps.

The problem is that in order to fire 4 rails, you have to hit timerefresh 5 times. Depending on the hardware, that amounts up to 10 seconds of standing still without aiming. I give you a 0.0000001% chance that this was the case.
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Offline quadz

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2010, 07:32:43 PM »
Demo of 'rail through corpse' bug: http://q2scene.net/ds/index.php?op=dd2&id=1112818918

It does at least 150, maybe does twice as much (200)?

could just do whatever is left over from gibbing the corpse... for example the corpse needs 20 damage to gib, it will transfer the other 80 damage to the other entity it hit with some flaw in the algorithm

This is almost certainly related to the 'passent' logic in the trace function.

The trace function can only be told to remember one entity for the trace to "pass through" (passent).  The passent parameter is called "ignore" in the code below.

Quote
void fire_rail (edict_t *self, vec3_t start, vec3_t aimdir, int damage, int kick)
{
    vec3_t      from;
    vec3_t      end;
    trace_t     tr;
    edict_t     *ignore;
    int         mask;
    qboolean    water;

    VectorMA (start, 8192, aimdir, end);
    VectorCopy (start, from);
    ignore = self;
    water = false;
    mask = MASK_SHOT|CONTENTS_SLIME|CONTENTS_LAVA;
    while (ignore)
    {
        tr = gi.trace (from, NULL, NULL, end, ignore, mask);

        if (tr.contents & (CONTENTS_SLIME|CONTENTS_LAVA))
        {
            mask &= ~(CONTENTS_SLIME|CONTENTS_LAVA);
            water = true;
        }
        else
        {
            //ZOID--added so rail goes through SOLID_BBOX entities (gibs, etc)
            if ((tr.ent->svflags & SVF_MONSTER) || (tr.ent->client) ||
                (tr.ent->solid == SOLID_BBOX))
                ignore = tr.ent;
            else
                ignore = NULL;

            if ((tr.ent != self) && (tr.ent->takedamage))
                T_Damage (tr.ent, self, self, aimdir, tr.endpos, tr.plane.normal, damage, kick, 0, MOD_RAILGUN);
        }

        VectorCopy (tr.endpos, from);
    }

    // send gun puff / flash
    gi.WriteByte (svc_temp_entity);
    gi.WriteByte (TE_RAILTRAIL);
    gi.WritePosition (start);
    gi.WritePosition (tr.endpos);
    gi.multicast (self->s.origin, MULTICAST_PHS);
//  gi.multicast (start, MULTICAST_PHS);
    if (water)
    {
        gi.WriteByte (svc_temp_entity);
        gi.WriteByte (TE_RAILTRAIL);
        gi.WritePosition (start);
        gi.WritePosition (tr.endpos);
        gi.multicast (tr.endpos, MULTICAST_PHS);
    }

    if (self->client)
        PlayerNoise(self, tr.endpos, PNOISE_IMPACT);
}


Initially ignore is set to the entity of the player who fired the rail (SELF) ... then it traces in the vector direction, ignoring SELF.  If the trace hits another monster, player, or solid, then ignore is set to that entity, damage is applied to that entity (if applicable), and the trace continues.

This works fine when entities are not overlapping.

When entities are overlapping, and the trace would pass through the overlapping parts of the entities, we have a problem.  The trace cannot move forward, because it can only be told to ignore one of the two overlapping entities.  So the loop above keeps hitting any overlapping entity not currently being ignored, and does damage, then tries again, and now hits the OTHER overlapping entity, does damage, repeat until somebody dies and there's no more overlap, and it can finally continue the trace.

This problem used to crash the game when there were overlapping entities which could not be damaged.  An example is in the easter egg room on boss2, with the easter chicks cuddling up to the strogg.  Firing a rail into those entities, which overlap and cannot be damaged, would hang forver in that loop above.

As a work around, r1ch added logic in r1q2 server so that if trace is called too many times in a given game frame, it assumes it is stuck in an infinite loop and bails out.

In summary: each overlapping entity affected by the rail trace will keep taking the full damage from the railgun shot, until enough are dead that there is no more overlap.  (And the survivor will get hit one final time with full damage, after which the trace can finally move forward.)


Regards,

quadz

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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: weapon power
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2010, 02:45:33 AM »
God... that quadz guy is SUCH a show off.  Here we are, perfectly content with our naive discussion, and he has to barge in here with his "knowledge" and ruin all the fun.  :dohdohdoh:

(And the survivor will get hit one final time with full damage, after which the trace can finally move forward.)

I guess this means in the case of one of the entities being a corpse, and the other a player, the player will take 200 damage, or double the normal rail amount?
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