IRON-FISTED DRACONIAN FORUM POSTING RULES

[Arm0r]

In fact, now I know you've never put any real time into looking into it.

You assumed I was kicked for "being a dick", I was kicked (and banned) for simply playing, didn't say a word....keep reaching for something that's not there.

[console]

In fact, now I know you've never put any real time into looking into it.

You assumed I was kicked for "being a dick", I was kicked (and banned) for simply playing, didn't say a word....keep reaching for something that's not there.

Actually I didn't assume any of those March-April kicks related to you at all.  (Did they?)

As far as you being a dick, I'm just judging by your behavior on the forums (averaged over a long period of time.)


Regards,

quadz

[Arm0r]

nope, wasn't me that time.

doesn't change the fact that she is going to do what she does, you act like putting normal admin restrictions on her is some sort of huge injustice to her, all it would do is force her to act like a real admin or gtfo--but that would be to easy huh?    Let's not do anything drastic like remedy the problem or anything, no, instead let's just sit here and debate the problem...hell, im sure spawngirl is up for the rcon password too, why not, she's a solid all around admin right?

[console]

doesn't change the fact that she is going to do what she does, you act like putting normal admin restrictions on her is some sort of huge injustice to her, all it would do is force her to act like a real admin or gtfo--but that would be to easy huh?

Here's the part where I'm confused.

Let's say for the sake of argument that spawngirl has all this time been renting the xrazy port, paying the usual monthly fee.

Should I be putting 'normal admin restrictions' on a paid server port?

(BTW, I'm not trying to be snide, it may be we have different views on admin restrictions on paid servers, I don't know.)


Regards,

quadz

[Arm0r]

doesn't change the fact that she is going to do what she does, you act like putting normal admin restrictions on her is some sort of huge injustice to her, all it would do is force her to act like a real admin or gtfo--but that would be to easy huh?

Here's the part where I'm confused.

Let's say for the sake of argument that spawngirl has all this time been renting the xrazy port, paying the usual monthly fee.

Should I be putting 'normal admin restrictions' on a paid server port?

(BTW, I'm not trying to be snide, it may be we have different views on admin restrictions on paid servers, I don't know.)


Regards,

quadz

If she was paying the normal fee then id be there on her dime, so no, I wouldn't ask for any admin restrictions due to the fact she paid out of her pocket to in fact own the server for the time being--in fact if it was somene who acted civil I wouldn't have any problem with it either.

My grief is the fact that she acts like she does and is being rewarded for it, you even said yourself xatrix usually has half as many active players on it so should I ever want to play the mod I have to wade through her broken english ranting, constant bothering..and then  a kick/ban..simply for playing on the server.

Put yourself in my shoes, let's say your at work, you do your work, your boss governs it and all is right with the world due to the limitations he places on you...then some guy who makes staplers happens to get his own cubicle in the office where he is without any rules, he can act like a dick, sputter out sentence fragments while telling you to stay the fuck out of his corner of the office....and all your boss has to say is "the guy makes great staplers, gotta keep em, deal with it"

So yeah, if SHE was paying for it, id have no problem.

[console]

BTW,

So yeah, if SHE was paying for it, id have no problem.

That's what I meant by, "So... the chief complaint is that I waived the monthly server fees?"

My grief is the fact that she acts like she does and is being rewarded for it, you even said yourself xatrix usually has half as many active players on it so should I ever want to play the mod I have to wade through her broken english ranting, constant bothering..and then  a kick/ban..simply for playing on the server.

Again, though, unless I have totally botched my greps, when we search the logs we see astonishingly few admin actions on her part.

Put yourself in my shoes, let's say your at work, you do your work, your boss governs it and all is right with the world due to the limitations he places on you...then some guy who makes staplers happens to get his own cubicle in the office where he is without any rules, he can act like a dick, sputter out sentence fragments while telling you to stay the fuck out of his corner of the office....and all your boss has to say is "the guy makes great staplers, gotta keep em, deal with it"

Excuse me? Excuse me, senor? May I speak to you please? I asked for a mai tai, and they brought me a pina colada, and I said no salt, NO salt for the margarita, but it had salt on it, big grains of salt, floating in the glass...

Er, I mean...

From my viewpoint, it seems reasonable enough to waive server fees under what I consider to be special circumstances.  For instance, for years I've had a policy of offering a shell account and free server hosting to quake mod developers.

And I was serious about the following:

But yeah.  I'm pretty sure I'm willing to extend this offer to anyone in the quake universe.  If you can show me 50 to 100 map overrides you've created for mod "X" that are maps that have never existed in that mod before, and it's obvious to the admins that some real creativity and thought went into the overrides, then yes: I will happily host your server and waive the rental fees.  This offer would apply to quakeworld, q2, q3, q4, warsow, etc.

To me, quake mod development seems like as good a reason to host someone's server as monthly fees.


Regards,

quadz

[X'tyfe]

I would like to clarify, was it really spawn that started on everyone or was it everyone that started on her? My impression so far is that shit was started on her first and she responded (Which is a totally normal reaction), although she did not handle this situation very well at that point and only made it worse and continues to do so.

If that's not right at all, and she did (I WANT PROOF!) start this herself with no poking from under the bridge, then I will no longer have a reason to defend her.



But as it seems for now, I would like to address a few things stated here so far:

Accountability, should she be accountable for all the drama that was caused by others? Should she be accountable for defending herself? Despite the fact that she did make things worse for herself by throwing back insults, I would argue that was a form of defense. Even if this was started by her, shouldn't the ones that kept on poking her take some responsibility too?

Kicking on her server, I would agree that she is not the true owner of the server and quadz should have the ultimate say regarding it. However she does have some rights despite that, quadz did give her admin rights suggesting that it is sort of unofficially hers and I think she should have the right to kick anyone that might start shit with her to keep the peace on the server. I don't believe she would do it without reason, from what I understand most of the people she has banned HAVE started shit with her.

In the end I don't believe that this needed to be brought back again, should have stayed dead and done.

[haunted]

it's ok... when I come back to q2 my flaming sword of moderation/admining will divert any attention away from spawngirl petty fladmining.

and yes i'm reallly trying to come back! I know I keep saying that but I actually arranged to borrow an optical mouse from someone today and should pick it up in an hour when i get off work

[The Happy Friar]

I don't pay quadz for my server & I'm listed on TS...  I'm pretty much in the same boat as spawn in regards to quadz & servers.  So's peewee I think.

From what I'm gathering, the consensus is that because she's being relatively annoying quadz should do something about that & not about anyone else who has servers associated with TS.  Quadz doesn't seem like a double standard kind of guy to me.

[Slayer :D]

On the other hand...I know that d3s pays for the lithium servers out of his own pocket, and he does get final say on them.

To the point, in my opinion, ANYBODY WHO *PAYS* FOR THE SERVER GETS RIGHTS! THUS QUADZ HAS FULL RIGHTS ON ANY SERVER HE PAYS FOR!

(Which, BTW, is most servers on TS.)

[peewee_RotA]

I don't pay quadz for my server & I'm listed on TS...  I'm pretty much in the same boat as spawn in regards to quadz & servers.  So's peewee I think.

Yep, I run mine on an old computer upstairs. Quadz was nice enough to put them on goto 



One thing that I should probably point out is that I've never had to kick or ban anyone on my servers. So 2 kicks in 45 days seems like a lot to me. I have very significantly less traffic but I run a custom mod server and an FFA map server with no user control (no mymap, or votemap) so I'm hardpressed to think of any reason that I'd ever kick someone. Armor, if it makes you feel any better you can dominate either of my servers, make fun of my mother, and tell me all of my maps suck. I won't kick you 



EDIT*****

Actually probably racial slurs... I don't find them funny at all. But armor I'll give you a free pass to be as racist as you want if you'd like 

[Arm0r]

I would like to clarify, was it really spawn that started on everyone or was it everyone that started on her? My impression so far is that shit was started on her first and she responded (Which is a totally normal reaction), although she did not handle this situation very well at that point and only made it worse and continues to do so.

If that's not right at all, and she did (I WANT PROOF!) start this herself with no poking from under the bridge, then I will no longer have a reason to defend her.



But as it seems for now, I would like to address a few things stated here so far:

Accountability, should she be accountable for all the drama that was caused by others? Should she be accountable for defending herself? Despite the fact that she did make things worse for herself by throwing back insults, I would argue that was a form of defense. Even if this was started by her, shouldn't the ones that kept on poking her take some responsibility too?

Kicking on her server, I would agree that she is not the true owner of the server and quadz should have the ultimate say regarding it. However she does have some rights despite that, quadz did give her admin rights suggesting that it is sort of unofficially hers and I think she should have the right to kick anyone that might start shit with her to keep the peace on the server. I don't believe she would do it without reason, from what I understand most of the people she has banned HAVE started shit with her.

In the end I don't believe that this needed to be brought back again, should have stayed dead and done.

I don't have to provide any proof the logs themselves can give, when I connected and start playing went something like this:

Armor connects.

Armor rapes 4 maps straight.

Spawngirl:  !invite  armor says he is the best player ever, he said he can beat all of you

10 mins later.

Armor was kicked.

Armor reconnects.

Armor: wtf was the kick for, that's bullshit.

Armor was banned.

If you're going to require evidence to the fact then wouldn't it seem more level headed to want both sides of it rather than "I have no idea what the situation is but ill believe spawngirl blindly...for some reason I can't explain"


Quadz-

My chief complaint is that she has no limitations based on how she uses her admin, the fact you plan to place none on her THEN makes my chief complaint that she doesn't pay for the server....I wouldn't care if you gave her 8 free servers if she had to conduct herself in a civil way on them..

[console]

I would like to clarify, was it really spawn that started on everyone or was it everyone that started on her? My impression so far is that shit was started on her first and she responded (Which is a totally normal reaction), although she did not handle this situation very well at that point and only made it worse and continues to do so.

If that's not right at all, and she did (I WANT PROOF!) start this herself with no poking from under the bridge, then I will no longer have a reason to defend her.

I'm reminded of the Albert Camus quote, "Alas after a certain age, every man is responsible for his own face."

(And no, I don't mean 'man' literally in this case.)

Xtyfe, I have little doubt spawngirl feels her various abrasive behavior has been justified, because it was always someone else who "started it".

But the problem with willfully emulating the worst behavior of one's adversaries, is after awhile it becomes impossible to distinguish which 'side' is behaving badly.  I think we passed that point a long time ago.

Further, to make things more complicated, spawngirl is quick to make enemies, often becoming angry with someone for a perceived-but-nonexistent insult.  I've seen this sort of thing happen numerous times:

20:30:43 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: i deleted all
20:30:50 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: i deleted the forum
20:30:55 * EXTERMINADER: Why?
20:31:06 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: because tastyspleen admin mute me
20:31:14 * EXTERMINADER: Mute you how?
20:31:16 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: when a asshole was insulting me
...
20:42:58 * EXTERMINADER: What are you so mad at?
20:43:12 * EXTERMINADER: Got to be more than a rogue admin muting you...
20:43:24 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: idk
20:43:26 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: i was muted
20:43:37 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: and that person is a known bad person
20:43:40 * EXTERMINADER: Thats houldn't mean that much to you...
20:43:42 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: the person who insulted me
20:43:47 * EXTERMINADER: So WHAT!
20:43:55 * EXTERMINADER: There are MANY assholes...
20:44:03 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: he can make overrides
20:44:06 * EXTERMINADER: You CAN'T take them all on verbally
20:44:07 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: he can have this server
20:44:11 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: he was not muted like me
20:44:23 * EXTERMINADER: Again, so WHAT!
20:44:27 * EXTERMINADER: Fuckem...
20:44:45 * EXTERMINADER: Don't get in a pissing match with them Spawn...ignore them
...
20:53:05 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: i have a strong personality
20:53:11 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: if i say never is never
20:53:13 * EXTERMINADER: So prove it
20:53:32 * EXTERMINADER: I mean, prove you are better than the scum that brings you down
20:53:34 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: you saw i already deleted my forum
20:53:48 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: you cannot make a backup of that kinde of forums
20:53:52 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: is not possible
20:53:56 * EXTERMINADER: thats more a knee jerk reaction
20:54:36 * EXTERMINADER: :^)
20:54:42 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: mm
20:54:44 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: jerk?
20:54:51 * [XZ]Spawn Girl: you are saying that im a jerk now?

Miraculously, in the above case, others on the server were able to quickly point out that "knee jerk" is an idiomatic phrase rather than an insult.  But I've witnessed other occasions when a permanent or long-lasting enmity was formed instantly over an equally trivial misunderstanding.

But, yes Xtyfe, if we go back far enough in time, it is probably true to say in spawngirl's case that originally "someone else started it."

But at this point I think, to paraphrase Camus, she is responsible for her own face.


Regards,

quadz

[The Happy Friar]

To the point, in my opinion, ANYBODY WHO *PAYS* FOR THE SERVER GETS RIGHTS! THUS QUADZ HAS FULL RIGHTS ON ANY SERVER HE PAYS FOR!

but as far as quadz is concerned, she's paying for her own server.  Just because there's no paypal transaction doesn't mean there isn't a transaction of some kind.  and he pointed out many times that all the override work = payment enough for her to have a server.

He also said if someone else did that many overrides for a specific mod he'd most likely give them a server too.

Which goes back to the only issue is that people are mad @ her, she hasn't violated any laws or hasn't broken any of quadz server rules.

[Arm0r]

Which goes back to the only issue is that people are mad @ her, she hasn't violated any laws or hasn't broken any of quadz server rules.

actually, she's broken plenty of quadz server rules, they just simply don't apply to her.