Ethics Based Server?

[Dafremen>FAS>]

Yes, it's an interesting idea. One which has been unsuccessfully tried for many years by various clans, Gator's [BTF] being one of those.

Plain and simple: the people that claim to want a server like this, aren't willing to sit around alone long enuff to let the population start to build up. Slooooowly but surely, it'll get to be lower and lower on their "priority list of servers to check first." Eventually it isn't checked at all. (see clan FAS has been working on this for a very l0ong time, since about '99..so we've made most of the mistakes and determined many of the causes.)

Or this is another reall common scenerio: The folks who are borderline for ethics feel too constricted by the few rules and eventually choose chaos over any degree of order. Orrrr...they'll occasionnally cross the line here and there (forgetting themselves due to bad habits learned on other servers) and someone will scream BLOOODY MUUURDERRR! Over a minor infraction. OR one of the mods is buddies with the player and lets it slide, then nails another player for the same infraction.

Rules are the problem. They always have been. They are the problem in society..and Quake2 (or any gaming community) being a microcosm of world society, they are a problem in this game too. Rules are a fat sign flatly stating TWO things:

We don't trust your judgement, so here's the choice you'll be making.
We are prepared to force this upon you if you do not comply.

A long time ago, I provided a solution to the problem, but it wasn't well received, because it isn't very practical to implement.

The idea was this: Instead of modding and pointing out how people are intentionally or unintentionally playing unethically, you advise players, then exclude yourself from the game when you see that behavior repeated. If its a bot, eventually, everyone will get botted or be made aware that a bot is there. Once all other players are excluded from the game (by simply choosing not to respawn.) The crap player's interest wanes...they whine and call people a few names then leave. It works for any ethics violation because it naturally works out the issue of what the servers population finds acceptable. If one guy is overly sensitive to certain behaviors (guilty as charged), he'll end up sitting out alone. But if it is an issue that is found commonly unethical..it will quickly be hard to find targets in the game.

Years of working with groups and especially these sorts of issues has led me to the conclusion that you can only lead by example and try to coax them to your way of thinking. Rules just get more involved and make way for software security, then ways of circumventing that security, then client side programs to ensure integrity...and on and on.

As a hacker from way back..er..(?)...let me assure you its a never ending game that rarely hurts the folks that are ruining the game. It simply makes the game a less free place to be for those who are playing it right...and for no good reason.

That's my 2 cents worth, and I sort of consider myself an expert on the subject since everything that has happened to this game so far has exactly met predictions made years ago.

Finally, let's not

[hieronymous]

Great to see you back these past two months --- you've always been a cool player.

You hit the point very well -- but as Gator said (as with all rules, ethics, morals, and mores), whether in or out of the game, it can only truly be acted upon by oneself ( not policed by, but truly believed in, to where it was nature not merely closely guarded actions)

and as for the ethics server ---maybe we need to integrate some porn on there or at least play some GWAR.

[jägermonsta]

and as for the ethics server ---maybe we need to integrate some porn on there or at least play some GWAR.

hahahaha 

that would truly make it ethical.

[haunted]

rofl @ seeing daf. FAS was always a clan based on ethics but you on the other hand did not act the way you preach. I was kicked and banned multiple times from your server just for reasons like not responding to you. This was in my newb days, so I really don't care. And you wondered why your server got killed repeatedly w/ the rcon hack *cough* sealteam6 *cough*. 

[DeanRW]

I used to play on some servers with fairly tight ethics like Velocity. It is always a great thing when it starts out but can unravel quickly. The issue with Ethic based servers, no spawn kills, camping, etc is that it usually starts off with a bunch of "sorry" or "reflex" responses and will eventually start escalating into a war of words along the ethics thrown out the window.

A server like that requires 24/7 monitoring as everyone has their own slightly different version of what is acceptable and their ego's will get in the way. The downside to a heavily monitored server can also have a negative effect as some players may play slightly outside of what an admin considers acceptable, feel like they are being picked on or singled out and leave the server never to play there again.

This is usually what happens with Ethic based servers. It is a very difficult thing to get everyone on the same page. Everyone has a different opinion of what they consider a cheap ass play, what they consider camping etc.

[magical pig]

Is there such a thing as ethical camping?

 


ima gonna connect one of these days - at least I now know there is such a thing!

thanks for bumping this Dafremen 

[Dafremen>FAS>]

Without going into the past too much, since it is dead and gone...I'd like to respond to your comments "haunted."

If you violate server rules, and a mod tries to make you aware of it, but you don't respond...instead rather, you continue violating the server rules...what would you have the mod do? Smile and let you continue?

The fact that you responded by hacking the server simply serves to illustrate that you didn't belong on an ethically-inclined server in the first place. What that means is, I stand by my decision.

Anyone that knows me knows I have tried to do more to help no0bz in this game, and more to try to keep it real than most players out there. I (and Rockcrusher) have always had very set ideas about how this game should be played, and if we tended to put up with less, it's because we've spent many years putting up with more shit than you'd believe. Including little boys with ego problems throwing temper tantrums and hacking into our servers.

Nuff said.

daf

[haunted]

You were a dick, I killed your server repeatedly / whenever I wanted to; for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

[BadCompany]

You were a dick, I killed your server repeatedly / whenever I wanted to; for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Are you kidding me!?! You killed someones server because you couldnt have your way, and got kicked? Am I understanding this right? So being an admited hacker they still let you play here? So whats next? You going to hack tasty?

[jägermonsta]

Are you kidding me!?! You killed someones server because you couldnt have your way, and got kicked? Am I understanding this right? So being an admited hacker they still let you play here? So whats next? You going to hack tasty?  Dude you have a definate problem, I hope admins here at tasty are watching you.
 

Where do people like BadCompany come from?... 

[BadCompany]

Where do people like BadCompany come from?...

[jägermonsta]

That all ya got? arnt you gonna say things like "my good buddy haunted is cool for killing the server?"  C'mon dude dont you want to be just like him? 

You are  .

  

[haunted]

I agree he is    but 
                                                    ^
                                                   not

[DWxchzrles]

You were a dick, I killed your server repeatedly / whenever I wanted to; for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

that is not the correct thing to do

[console]

You were a dick, I killed your server repeatedly / whenever I wanted to; for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

that is not the correct thing to do

Haven't you heard the old saying, "TWO WRONGS MAKE A HAUNTED"  ?
Or something like that...