Poll

How many of you play with an inverted mouse?

I do
I dont

Author Topic: Inverted mouse  (Read 3807 times)

Offline animosity

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Inverted mouse
« on: April 27, 2014, 12:07:14 AM »
Just a question that came up while talking with greenz. He does, I don't.
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Offline The Happy Friar

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2014, 03:57:02 AM »
Inverted is when you move your mouse up it looks up, right?  Because the other way is that should happen in "real life".  :)
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Offline animosity

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2014, 09:13:12 AM »
Inverted is when you move your mouse up it looks up, right?  Because the other way is that should happen in "real life".  :)

No, inverted is when you move your mouse up and it looks down. Which sounds crazy to me. How is that like real life? lol
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Offline The Happy Friar

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2014, 09:41:03 AM »
No, inverted is when you move your mouse up and it looks down. Which sounds crazy to me. How is that like real life? lol

Imagine a stick popping out of the top of your head.  Now, push the stick forward.  Your head looks down.  Pull the stick back.  You head looks up.  Your mouse is the top of that stick.

That is the "inverted" mouth method.

Push the stick forward.  Your head looks up.  Pull the stick back.  Your head looks down.

That in the "non-inverted" method.

The unreal "non-inverted" method was invented for PC FPS gamers.   Originally "inverted" was called "airplane controls".   

I want to say the only reason it was not done by default is that when PC shooters wrote their own mouse interfaces (DOS) it was easier to not automatically invert the mouse Y values.  So yes, I'm saying that the programmers who made the fist FPS games were lazy.  Once consoles became popular the joystick (very popular with home computers, more so then mice) idea died out and gamers no longer knew how to properly control their avatar from a real life physical way, and they accepted the fake way as the correct and normal way.  throw in the fact that Microsoft got a mouse in to every house eliminated the keyboard as the standard for FPS playing too.
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Offline quadz

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2014, 01:44:20 PM »
The unreal "non-inverted" method was invented for PC FPS gamers.   Originally "inverted" was called "airplane controls".   [...]  Once consoles became popular the joystick (very popular with home computers, more so then mice) idea died out and gamers no longer knew how to properly control their avatar from a real life physical way, and they accepted the fake way as the correct and normal way.

It's a false equivalence. The "real life physical way" is different because the two systems being modeled are different.

With Flight Controls, pushing forward is down elevator = nose down, which is normal.

With FPS controls, pushing up moves your eyes/head up, which is normal.

Unless you've installed elevator flaps on your neck let's dispense with this absurd notion of chaining FPS mouselook controls to mechanical flight control surfaces they have nothing to do with.


Imagine a stick popping out of the top of your head.

No. :smiley_abau: FPS mouselook doesn't emulate a joystick popping out of the top of your head!

(Just as it doesn't model levers behind your eyeballs that move down when your eyes move up!)


I want to say the only reason it was not done by default is that when PC shooters wrote their own mouse interfaces (DOS) it was easier to not automatically invert the mouse Y values.  So yes, I'm saying that the programmers who made the fi[r]st FPS games were lazy. 

Y-inversion works out to a single subtract statement (or a single negate operation, depending on where one hooks into the input stream.) If anyone were that lazy they'd have never made it past "Hello World."

In short: Your inverted FPS controls are bad and you should feel bad.  :nana:


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« Last Edit: April 27, 2014, 02:19:54 PM by quadz »
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Offline ex

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2014, 03:22:01 PM »
Inverted feels perfectly natural and fine to me.  I started with non-inverted at first and couldn't stand it; every time I would try to look up, I'd look down, and vice-versa.  Maybe I can't tell my up from down.   :D  Or maybe it's just more natural feeling.

I did play many years of flight-based games long before shooters, though, so that probably had a significant impact.
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Offline yahoo

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2014, 04:55:33 PM »
It boils down if your used to it.
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Offline quadz

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2014, 05:11:19 PM »
Inverted feels perfectly natural and fine to me.  I started with non-inverted at first and couldn't stand it; every time I would try to look up, I'd look down, and vice-versa.  Maybe I can't tell my up from down.   :D  Or maybe it's just more natural feeling.

Yep; the hyperbole in my prior post aside, it's clearly a matter of personal preference.

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Offline Jay Dolan

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2014, 07:06:50 PM »
Inverted feels perfectly natural and fine to me.  I started with non-inverted at first and couldn't stand it; every time I would try to look up, I'd look down, and vice-versa.  Maybe I can't tell my up from down.   :D  Or maybe it's just more natural feeling.

I did play many years of flight-based games long before shooters, though, so that probably had a significant impact.

Same, for the same reason.

Offline haunted

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2014, 07:18:04 PM »
i prefer inverted controls for everything except in video games.
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Offline Whirlingdervish

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2014, 08:44:46 AM »
Inverted feels perfectly natural and fine to me.  I started with non-inverted at first and couldn't stand it; every time I would try to look up, I'd look down, and vice-versa.  Maybe I can't tell my up from down.   :D  Or maybe it's just more natural feeling.

I did play many years of flight-based games long before shooters, though, so that probably had a significant impact.

Same, for the same reason.

this.

First game I played a lot that had a real free look/3d environment was the old Red Baron flight sim on the mac.

I think the mouse was also inverted by default in Duke3d and that was the first FPS I played heavily.

old habits  ;)
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Offline animosity

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2014, 03:30:36 PM »
Never really realized that I using both setups with my mouse (not inverted) and my joystick (inverted? joystick look?) But I could never play q2 with an inverted mouse or fly using a joystick without pulling the joystick up to pitch up.
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Offline VaeVictis

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #12 on: April 28, 2014, 06:55:29 PM »
Yeah I just play with inverted everything

d goes left, a goes right

whole nine yards
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Offline RyU

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2014, 07:43:26 PM »
I also play with inverted mouse I dunno why I do but thats just who I am. I cannot play the other way it is weird son
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Offline haunted

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Re: Inverted mouse
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2014, 08:22:48 AM »
inverted controls(different tractors, heavy machinery, planes, etc.) all make sense to me whether it's pitch control or controlling an attachment to the machine. There's a purpose for it being this way.

But, inverted controls in a 3d simulation/video game is just preference, and I'd much rather my movement in-game correspond to the actual movement inputs I'm executing opposed to backwards. That is just me though.
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