Author Topic: Current Politics & History Only Thread  (Read 175700 times)

Offline ImperiusDamian

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1020 on: March 05, 2020, 04:09:58 PM »
Consider this:

If he appears on TV tomorrow screaming "EVERYBODY'S GONNA DIEEEEE!!!!!" would it improve your opinion of him? You're gonna hate him either way. So perhaps he knows that and finds it more preferable not to further panic the public. Is the President supposed to do things to possibly hurt the economy?

What is it you're hoping for? That he comes out wringing his hands and sweating and saying, "It's bad, it's really bad, I got a bad feeling about this one. Oh no. What are we gonna do!?!" We have every last news outlet already constantly reminding us how many people have died from it. His opinion is quite irrelevant whatever it may happen to be. He looks like a feeble helpless idiot. Be happy about it.

Either way any sane person isn't going to listen to a word of it. I'll trust a medical professional over a politician (or for that matter a reality show host :P) in a matter like this any time. Personally I'm not worried about it, simply because worrying isn't going to accomplish anything either way.
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Offline quadz

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1021 on: March 05, 2020, 05:40:46 PM »
Is there a time and place Trump should simply be honest to the American public about important matters like this, or is it fine that he tells us whatever he wants us to believe?

Well, here's someone's attempt at the "let's get real" version:


https://twitter.com/EricRWeinstein/status/1234300424804429824  (thread)

Not sure I can imagine any President taking that approach.

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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1022 on: March 05, 2020, 07:03:57 PM »
How about simply echoing the figures that the experts who are literally at his beck and call whenever he would need them are saying? Why mix in his own numbers? People will eagerly eat up anything he says and will willfully dismiss expert advice and knowledge in favor of whatever Trump comes up with. The anti-intellectualism movement is fully behind Trump.
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Offline haunted

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1023 on: March 06, 2020, 04:34:40 AM »
I looked up his "hunch" on the coronavirus death rate. He thinks 3.4% is a false number and it's probably lower due to unknown cases where people thought they were just fighting off a cold of some degree and recovered on their own. That doesn't seem unreasonable to me, but only time will tell if he's correct. I don't know what else you can expect from a president than to 1) focus all efforts into stopping/slowing the spread and 2) discourage panic. Currently in my hometown every store is sold out of hand sanitizer and all cold medicine. I actually bought 8 48ct cases of bottled water, 20 lbs of ground beef that I portioned and put in my chest freezer, and a couple cases of canned tomatoes and canned green beans 1.5 weeks ago, and I'm glad I did. Because if trump was doing exactly what you want him to do then all of the shelves would be empty.
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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1024 on: March 06, 2020, 05:37:49 AM »
And what is it that I want him to do? Maybe I'm being misunderstood.
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Offline haunted

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1025 on: March 06, 2020, 07:57:25 AM »
You want him to boast the current stats as if they're accurate, when in fact, every article that has a headline like this:

"The flu and the new coronavirus have similar symptoms, but the coronavirus is far deadlier — here's how the 2 compare"

has a paragraph like this near the bottom:

"The fatality rate of the novel coronavirus is still evolving, however, as more cases are confirmed. Many health experts believe that the rate will drop as the number of cases rises. That's because an estimated 80% of coronavirus cases are mild, and patients checking into hospitals have the most severe symptoms. People with symptoms mild enough to recover at home without seeking medical treatment aren't counted in the official totals."

So, it's not just trump who has that hunch. I understand what you're saying, but I also understand that you'll be mad at trump no matter what he does. That is very obvious.

Article from quotes: https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-compared-to-flu-mortality-rates-2020-3
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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1026 on: March 06, 2020, 09:05:36 AM »
You want him to boast the current stats as if they're accurate

We should expect him not to share his "hunches" (his word) on things he doesn't have expertise on, particularly when they conflict with those of the actual experts. He doesn't need to mention them at all, but if he insists in doing so, use the actual figures, whatever they are currently, don't pull a number that sounds good to you out of your ass and share it with the entire country.
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Offline Punk_FAS

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1027 on: March 06, 2020, 09:06:54 AM »
but I also understand that you'll be mad at trump no matter what he does. That is very obvious.
It's funny you mention this, because from my perspective, it's "obvious" that you'll defend him no matter what he does.
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Offline |iR|Focalor

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1028 on: March 06, 2020, 10:31:35 AM »
People will eagerly eat up anything he says and will willfully dismiss expert advice and knowledge in favor of whatever Trump comes up with. The anti-intellectualism movement is fully behind Trump.

Well... I wouldn't call it a "movement", like it's something a different, a new trend. A portion of the population is and always has been just plain old boggar-eating stupid. Typically I've thought of the lifetime Republican voting crowd to have a much larger portion of the ultra-stupid population. But these days, it seems like the left is organically growing their own crop of free-range retards. The kinds that want to completely eliminate thoughts about gender identity, the warriors of social justice and politically correctness, etc. If there is an anti-intellectual movement, that's where it's happening.
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Offline haunted

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1029 on: March 06, 2020, 10:36:49 AM »
Umm... I have made it clear that I do NOT like trump. I have to advertise it to anti-trumpers so you don't say crap like that, which I have repeatedly done again and again. Just because I recognize some bias and unfairness towards him doesn't make me a fan of his nor should you lump your relentless anti-trumpism with anything I'm doing.

Not sure I can imagine any President taking that approach.

^He's correct. But it's Trump so. . . .

You want him to boast the current stats as if they're accurate

We should expect him not to share his "hunches" (his word) on things he doesn't have expertise on, particularly when they conflict with those of the actual experts. He doesn't need to mention them at all, but if he insists in doing so, use the actual figures, whatever they are currently, don't pull a number that sounds good to you out of your ass and share it with the entire country.

Like I said,

every article that has a headline like this:

"The flu and the new coronavirus have similar symptoms, but the coronavirus is far deadlier — here's how the 2 compare"

has a paragraph like this near the bottom:

"The fatality rate of the novel coronavirus is still evolving, however, as more cases are confirmed. Many health experts believe that the rate will drop as the number of cases rises. That's because an estimated 80% of coronavirus cases are mild, and patients checking into hospitals have the most severe symptoms. People with symptoms mild enough to recover at home without seeking medical treatment aren't counted in the official totals."

So, it's not just trump who has that hunch. I understand what you're saying, but I also understand that you'll be mad at trump no matter what he does. That is very obvious.

Article from quotes: https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-compared-to-flu-mortality-rates-2020-3
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Offline haunted

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1030 on: March 06, 2020, 10:48:35 AM »
Really it's how contagious covid-19 is, and that it has a 15-20% hospitalization rate, that make it worrisome. It's not the "hunch" trump had about the death rate that's probably not far off.
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Offline quadz

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1031 on: March 06, 2020, 11:12:35 AM »
It's funny you mention this, because from my perspective, it's "obvious" that you'll defend him no matter what he does.

I think we should distinguish between explanations and defense.

For example, this statement from a quarantined nurse:



We've seen rumblings for weeks now that the CDC has protocols in place that put seemingly extraordinary hurdles in the way of testing. They seem to rationing a limited number of test kits, whereas other countries are able to obtain far higher quantities of kits.

In pondering this, I began to suspect (and I've seen others on social media thinking similarly) that this is a deliberate strategy: Since any genuine possibility of containment was off the table before the end of January, everything since then has been sort of "containment theater."

Rationing test kits, and placing procedural barriers to testing, seems to limit testing to those only with the most serious symptoms. Which keeps the numbers low. And which may in practicality help curb panic while the thing inevitably spreads.

It's an explanation I find at least plausible. And in purely pragmatic terms, one can imagine it being effective (psychologically.)

But an explanation of something shouldn't automatically be confused with a defense of that thing.

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Offline quadz

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1032 on: March 06, 2020, 01:10:15 PM »

https://twitter.com/RealSaavedra/status/1235802419734269952

As someone commented: "This wasn’t some off-the-cuff live-TV moment. It was a planned graphic. Imagine how many people’s hands, and brains, this had to pass through in order for it to make onto the air and then receive the endorsement of the two people on air."

 :1poke:
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Offline haunted

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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1033 on: March 06, 2020, 01:27:33 PM »
Hah! I was just searching on YouTube for a clip of this 15 mins ago to post here but couldn't find one.

Amazing. They belong on Fox and friends  :dohdohdoh:

Edit: actually, this is just like everything else. How insane is it that there are daytime shows rivaling and perhaps surpassing the stupidity of fox and friends?
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Re: Current Politics & History Only Thread
« Reply #1034 on: March 06, 2020, 01:42:58 PM »
 :D

They're making BILLIONS of dollars a day at their jobs. What the fuck would they know about poverty. :dohdohdoh:
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